Lol. You haven't changed, Manny, and your facts about Hamas are impeccable.
I remember when Israel feared the PFLP even more than the PLO. I don't remember a time when they ever feared the Muslim Brotherhood. There's a reason for that, and you provided it.
Wonderful to see you around, OB! Hope all is well for you, my friend.
Oh, I didn't know before that the Zionist regime were steeped in greater dread towards the PFLP than the PLO -- thanks for sharing that recollection of yours. Your mention of the PFLP is most awesomely well-timed: I'm going to have to write up another post soon about Syria exposing the sheer hypocrisy of controlled opposition "pro-Palestine" sectors.
Guess I’m lucky bc I don’t know any anti-capitalists that fit the description of your first five bullet points. The sixth? Very interesting and not surprising, but isn’t re-aligning against a sponsor pretty common in…the world? And very common in ME, Ie, hezbollah, houthis, Islamic state etc? The anti caps I know don’t care who physically resists or destroys Zionists or IOF. Just glad they do. Full stop. I guess we’re simple people.
I am not trying to fact check you, but assuming you are probably right it does not reduce every movement as mere psy-ops, diversion, useful idiots or what have you. First, because genuine resistance can blossom and have enough traction to gain autonomy from the "leadership"; second because the financing of the opposition is a way to be able to predict or even provoke acts of resistance, the goal here is more narrative driven. Indeed, it gives Zionists/western neo-colonialists a narrative edge over action of resistance rightly seen as inevitable. I not trying to discredit your research but I think it desperately needs a dialectic approach in order to avoid "throwing away the baby with the bathwater"! I am open for such a debate if you're willing to, because it can exemplify the hollowness of binary thinking and dialectic thinking is central to any radical critique of capitalism. Are you in?
Yes, I agree that not every single movement is a controlled-opposition puppet of the international Zionist-Masonic conspiracy, let alone at an equal plane.
Let's look at the PLO-Hamas issue closely: the intellectual, secular, older Palestinian generations were politically aligned with the left-wing Palestine Liberation Organization and favored rational policies towards long-term stability over misguided populism that elevates the uncivilized rabble-rousers. Who did the Zionist-Masonic conspirators target for destruction? The PLO. Not Hamas -- the Muslim Brotherhood and its regional offshoots were constructed and tactically deployed by the Zionist-Masonic conspiracy to undermine Arab nationalists, secularists, Shi'a resistance, and just about all left-wing popular fronts.
Conclusion: the old PLO were the real dissidents; Hamas was created and lobbed by the criminal Masonic delinquents of Moschutzstaffelad (Mo-SS-ad) to destroy Palestinian national liberation. It's really not that difficult.
On the topic on the PLO yes they were destroyed by the Zionist but be because they were naive enough to trust the israeli, accept money from them in a shadowy ways, and then the israeli intelligence gave this intel to opposition groups in order to frame the PLO in a never ending corruption accusation in order to kill the movement. But they indeed took the money and use it not to reinforce the PLO but to enrich its leaders. I would argue that this scenario has been use by the israeli to undermine (quite successfully) all the secular movements of liberation, pushing toward an islamic resistance that they could paint easier as terrorists. That's how hamas took control in 2006, however while receiving money from israel it has never been direst (via quatar, etc) giving them plausible deniability. Also the money was not embezzled by its leaders but used against israel. Why do you think we got very early this intel of Netanyahu, through qatar, giving them money: it was so the international public would disengage of the story. However hamas has escape effectively the israeli narrative, even though they were obviously given a free pass on october seven so israel could go in kill even more Israeli that the Hamas did and framed every thing on Hamas. However this narrative was eventually challenge by Hamas who used this opportunity to engage in real resistance, seeking support from real allies (Iran, Yemen). That being said, yes I would rather see a Palestinian liberation movement that is secular and engaging with marxist dialectics. However Hamas has seized this opportunity to effectively challenge the narratives etc. But who amI to judge a people that has been through so much, and maybe the Islamic component made them more immune to corruption. In the end I agree with you but I wanted to show that their is hope and that trying to find the prints of Zionist in every anti zionist movement is easy cause they engage in the oldest form of politics, divide and conquer. If you fall for this totalist narrative that is a highway for despair and inaction.
<div class="substack-post-embed"><p lang="en">Gaslit by Conspiracies: How focusing on Conspiracies Sabotages Palestine Solidarity by Camille lepallec</p><p>Conspiracy driven “anti-Zionism” feeds Netanyahu’s agenda—and your despair is the point. This is not a dismissal of the reality of some conspiracies but a rebuttal of reality as grand conspiracy.</p><a data-post-link href="https://thelowtide.substack.com/p/gaslit-by-conspiracies-how-focusing">Read on Substack</a></div><script async src="https://substack.com/embedjs/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Lol. You haven't changed, Manny, and your facts about Hamas are impeccable.
I remember when Israel feared the PFLP even more than the PLO. I don't remember a time when they ever feared the Muslim Brotherhood. There's a reason for that, and you provided it.
Wonderful to see you around, OB! Hope all is well for you, my friend.
Oh, I didn't know before that the Zionist regime were steeped in greater dread towards the PFLP than the PLO -- thanks for sharing that recollection of yours. Your mention of the PFLP is most awesomely well-timed: I'm going to have to write up another post soon about Syria exposing the sheer hypocrisy of controlled opposition "pro-Palestine" sectors.
Money... [sigh] Nasty and archaic stuff. All kinds of psychopathic things can manifest with that tool.
And yes, "Hamas" is CIA/Mossad created.
Money Motivates the Most Marvelous Manifestations! (article): https://amaterasusolar.substack.com/p/money-motivates-the-most-marvelous
Guess I’m lucky bc I don’t know any anti-capitalists that fit the description of your first five bullet points. The sixth? Very interesting and not surprising, but isn’t re-aligning against a sponsor pretty common in…the world? And very common in ME, Ie, hezbollah, houthis, Islamic state etc? The anti caps I know don’t care who physically resists or destroys Zionists or IOF. Just glad they do. Full stop. I guess we’re simple people.
I am not trying to fact check you, but assuming you are probably right it does not reduce every movement as mere psy-ops, diversion, useful idiots or what have you. First, because genuine resistance can blossom and have enough traction to gain autonomy from the "leadership"; second because the financing of the opposition is a way to be able to predict or even provoke acts of resistance, the goal here is more narrative driven. Indeed, it gives Zionists/western neo-colonialists a narrative edge over action of resistance rightly seen as inevitable. I not trying to discredit your research but I think it desperately needs a dialectic approach in order to avoid "throwing away the baby with the bathwater"! I am open for such a debate if you're willing to, because it can exemplify the hollowness of binary thinking and dialectic thinking is central to any radical critique of capitalism. Are you in?
Yes, I agree that not every single movement is a controlled-opposition puppet of the international Zionist-Masonic conspiracy, let alone at an equal plane.
Let's look at the PLO-Hamas issue closely: the intellectual, secular, older Palestinian generations were politically aligned with the left-wing Palestine Liberation Organization and favored rational policies towards long-term stability over misguided populism that elevates the uncivilized rabble-rousers. Who did the Zionist-Masonic conspirators target for destruction? The PLO. Not Hamas -- the Muslim Brotherhood and its regional offshoots were constructed and tactically deployed by the Zionist-Masonic conspiracy to undermine Arab nationalists, secularists, Shi'a resistance, and just about all left-wing popular fronts.
Conclusion: the old PLO were the real dissidents; Hamas was created and lobbed by the criminal Masonic delinquents of Moschutzstaffelad (Mo-SS-ad) to destroy Palestinian national liberation. It's really not that difficult.
On the topic on the PLO yes they were destroyed by the Zionist but be because they were naive enough to trust the israeli, accept money from them in a shadowy ways, and then the israeli intelligence gave this intel to opposition groups in order to frame the PLO in a never ending corruption accusation in order to kill the movement. But they indeed took the money and use it not to reinforce the PLO but to enrich its leaders. I would argue that this scenario has been use by the israeli to undermine (quite successfully) all the secular movements of liberation, pushing toward an islamic resistance that they could paint easier as terrorists. That's how hamas took control in 2006, however while receiving money from israel it has never been direst (via quatar, etc) giving them plausible deniability. Also the money was not embezzled by its leaders but used against israel. Why do you think we got very early this intel of Netanyahu, through qatar, giving them money: it was so the international public would disengage of the story. However hamas has escape effectively the israeli narrative, even though they were obviously given a free pass on october seven so israel could go in kill even more Israeli that the Hamas did and framed every thing on Hamas. However this narrative was eventually challenge by Hamas who used this opportunity to engage in real resistance, seeking support from real allies (Iran, Yemen). That being said, yes I would rather see a Palestinian liberation movement that is secular and engaging with marxist dialectics. However Hamas has seized this opportunity to effectively challenge the narratives etc. But who amI to judge a people that has been through so much, and maybe the Islamic component made them more immune to corruption. In the end I agree with you but I wanted to show that their is hope and that trying to find the prints of Zionist in every anti zionist movement is easy cause they engage in the oldest form of politics, divide and conquer. If you fall for this totalist narrative that is a highway for despair and inaction.
> "I would rather see a Palestinian liberation movement that is secular and engaging with marxist dialectics"
Marxism doesn't "work" -- all it leads to is fascism, whether outright or disguised as "real Communism." Almost every single time: https://adversusbabylon.substack.com/p/anglosubversion-commuzionism
<div class="substack-post-embed"><p lang="en">Gaslit by Conspiracies: How focusing on Conspiracies Sabotages Palestine Solidarity by Camille lepallec</p><p>Conspiracy driven “anti-Zionism” feeds Netanyahu’s agenda—and your despair is the point. This is not a dismissal of the reality of some conspiracies but a rebuttal of reality as grand conspiracy.</p><a data-post-link href="https://thelowtide.substack.com/p/gaslit-by-conspiracies-how-focusing">Read on Substack</a></div><script async src="https://substack.com/embedjs/embed.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
https://open.substack.com/pub/thelowtide/p/gaslit-by-conspiracies-how-focusing?r=5nx8r8&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=false
Go self-promote your Marxist conspiracy-denialist garbage elsewhere. I'm not wasting any more time dealing with your empty-talk bullshit.